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	<title>Comments on: A Fable</title>
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		<title>By: trademark registration</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-7427</link>
		<dc:creator>trademark registration</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:47:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-7427</guid>
		<description>FYI, the trademark registration for burning man can be viewed here: http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&amp;entry=78215401

It&#039;s owned by Paper Man, LLC, according to the U.S. Trademark Office records.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI, the trademark registration for burning man can be viewed here: <a href="http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&amp;entry=78215401" rel="nofollow">http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&amp;entry=78215401</a></p>
<p>It&#8217;s owned by Paper Man, LLC, according to the U.S. Trademark Office records.</p>
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		<title>By: Helena</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-6029</link>
		<dc:creator>Helena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2007 04:23:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-6029</guid>
		<description>Also to the Nudist issue you can not sell pictures of anyone with out having a 
written consent from the people in the video 
so trademark or not does not protect their naked asses</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also to the Nudist issue you can not sell pictures of anyone with out having a<br />
written consent from the people in the video<br />
so trademark or not does not protect their naked asses</p>
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		<title>By: Helena</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-6028</link>
		<dc:creator>Helena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2007 04:16:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-6028</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s history repeating I newer seen something not become part of the 
real world we live in even if the Idea is that it should be excluded and outside
the boundaries we all are part of .

I do not believe in a god either.

Ironically this years green man theme is just that are we slaves to ourselves or nature.
Man kind has traded I belive as long as we have existed.
Money does not makes the trade worse or better.

The only non profit organization event or happening would have to be organized
by individuals that do not eat or get old in order to be a true non profit.

Everybody  is always looking to have fun with out paying for it and there
is the contradiction.
In this world there is always a cost.

I have to say that I think one can enjoy it for what it is a reason to 
go out and do your thing.

I think giving the trademarks back could actually prove to be the most effective
PR campaign EVER !

Imagine the snowball effect on people getting the word out since there is actual profit in it for themselves.
 I be the first to put up a banner on my Office and sell little twig men or matchstick men for $50.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s history repeating I newer seen something not become part of the<br />
real world we live in even if the Idea is that it should be excluded and outside<br />
the boundaries we all are part of .</p>
<p>I do not believe in a god either.</p>
<p>Ironically this years green man theme is just that are we slaves to ourselves or nature.<br />
Man kind has traded I belive as long as we have existed.<br />
Money does not makes the trade worse or better.</p>
<p>The only non profit organization event or happening would have to be organized<br />
by individuals that do not eat or get old in order to be a true non profit.</p>
<p>Everybody  is always looking to have fun with out paying for it and there<br />
is the contradiction.<br />
In this world there is always a cost.</p>
<p>I have to say that I think one can enjoy it for what it is a reason to<br />
go out and do your thing.</p>
<p>I think giving the trademarks back could actually prove to be the most effective<br />
PR campaign EVER !</p>
<p>Imagine the snowball effect on people getting the word out since there is actual profit in it for themselves.<br />
 I be the first to put up a banner on my Office and sell little twig men or matchstick men for $50.</p>
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		<title>By: The Burning Man trademark controversy at FactoryCity</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-271</link>
		<dc:creator>The Burning Man trademark controversy at FactoryCity</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 04:41:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-271</guid>
		<description>[...] that when money starts changing hands, the original ethos and spirit of creation inevitably becomes undermined and damaged. I&#8217;ve seen this happen many times over &#8212; and when it doesn&#8217;t, it&#8217;s either [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] that when money starts changing hands, the original ethos and spirit of creation inevitably becomes undermined and damaged. I&#8217;ve seen this happen many times over &#8212; and when it doesn&#8217;t, it&#8217;s either [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Segue</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-261</link>
		<dc:creator>Segue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jan 2007 00:05:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-261</guid>
		<description>Gee, I&#039;m usually pretty opinionated about all things BurningMan but this is one helluva dilemma.  I haven&#039;t missed a year since &#039;96.  I&#039;m aware of much that has transpired, sometimes on the inside but more often from the outside.  I believe that J.L. was shafted--the details of why or how i don&#039;t know.  However, we need to remember WHY the LLC was created, and WHETHER these original goals will be comprimised if J.L. gets what he wants, legit bitterness and all.

&quot;Burning Man&quot; is still hot property.  Hard to see from within the insular San Francisco scene.  What to do? Let it go and change the name?  Speaking from experience, naming is really really difficult. And more important than a lot of people realize. 

YES on the above comment from Rob.  Let&#039;s SEE the REAL accounting numbers.  They hide too much and THAT makes me suspicious.   HAVE Larry and M2 (and the rest) been actually profiting the past few years from this arrangement, or are they just granting themselves a living wage?  If they aren&#039;t profiting, then why hide?  What&#039;s to be ashamed of if $200,000 goes to ammo, steak, whisky and rent on the heavy hydraulic machinery for the cleanup crew?  The truth is far more amusing than the omissions.  I&#039;d feel a lot more comfortable paying my $250 knowing that they piddled the money away in drunken revelry rather than each bought themselves new condos and RVs.

Oh, yeah, speaking of the $250.  Wouldn&#039;t it be a whole lot less money and effort for everybody involved if EVERYBODY had to buy a ticket (even the organizers)?  Tickets would cost 1/2 as much and we would ALL be participants again, on the level, no special privileges, but also no need for begging.  Just think, no botched lists, and the organizers can get some rest at night again rather than being harrassed by 10,000 &quot;artists&quot; all screaming for freebies.  It&#039;s embarrassing.  Can&#039;t you all go somewhere ELSE for your Welfare Checks?  No, getting free entry doesn&#039;t make you any more special.  Sorry.  It just means that you are better (and louder) at begging and cajoling than somebody else.  I know a lot of overqualified individuals who paid for their tickets AND made great contributions on the playa.   I&#039;ve got a lot of friends who would like to come, but can&#039;t afford it anymore; people who are still living outside the consumer society and not working for money.

BM is starting to stink like Country Fair, like a country club for old punk-rockers  (rather than old hippies).  It&#039;s not too late to turn it around.  Stop yer grousing and get on with it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gee, I&#8217;m usually pretty opinionated about all things BurningMan but this is one helluva dilemma.  I haven&#8217;t missed a year since &#8216;96.  I&#8217;m aware of much that has transpired, sometimes on the inside but more often from the outside.  I believe that J.L. was shafted&#8211;the details of why or how i don&#8217;t know.  However, we need to remember WHY the LLC was created, and WHETHER these original goals will be comprimised if J.L. gets what he wants, legit bitterness and all.</p>
<p>&#8220;Burning Man&#8221; is still hot property.  Hard to see from within the insular San Francisco scene.  What to do? Let it go and change the name?  Speaking from experience, naming is really really difficult. And more important than a lot of people realize. </p>
<p>YES on the above comment from Rob.  Let&#8217;s SEE the REAL accounting numbers.  They hide too much and THAT makes me suspicious.   HAVE Larry and M2 (and the rest) been actually profiting the past few years from this arrangement, or are they just granting themselves a living wage?  If they aren&#8217;t profiting, then why hide?  What&#8217;s to be ashamed of if $200,000 goes to ammo, steak, whisky and rent on the heavy hydraulic machinery for the cleanup crew?  The truth is far more amusing than the omissions.  I&#8217;d feel a lot more comfortable paying my $250 knowing that they piddled the money away in drunken revelry rather than each bought themselves new condos and RVs.</p>
<p>Oh, yeah, speaking of the $250.  Wouldn&#8217;t it be a whole lot less money and effort for everybody involved if EVERYBODY had to buy a ticket (even the organizers)?  Tickets would cost 1/2 as much and we would ALL be participants again, on the level, no special privileges, but also no need for begging.  Just think, no botched lists, and the organizers can get some rest at night again rather than being harrassed by 10,000 &#8220;artists&#8221; all screaming for freebies.  It&#8217;s embarrassing.  Can&#8217;t you all go somewhere ELSE for your Welfare Checks?  No, getting free entry doesn&#8217;t make you any more special.  Sorry.  It just means that you are better (and louder) at begging and cajoling than somebody else.  I know a lot of overqualified individuals who paid for their tickets AND made great contributions on the playa.   I&#8217;ve got a lot of friends who would like to come, but can&#8217;t afford it anymore; people who are still living outside the consumer society and not working for money.</p>
<p>BM is starting to stink like Country Fair, like a country club for old punk-rockers  (rather than old hippies).  It&#8217;s not too late to turn it around.  Stop yer grousing and get on with it!</p>
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		<title>By: Webdaddy</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-221</link>
		<dc:creator>Webdaddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:05:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-221</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s not completely bad that someone &quot;own&quot; Burning Man. If the trademark is not protected, it becomes common usage. 
 
Burning Man being public domain sounds great in theory, but if anyone can use the title Burning Man that also means nothing can stop Burning Man Girls Gone Wild hitting your local video store. Videos exploiting our community have already been stopped because of trademarks/copyrights in the past. Imagine nudity being taken out of context. Imagine you lose your job because your employer sees the video. Imagine what happens to the event if people feel less free to radically express themselves. 
 
There is also more ability to control the message. To a lot of outsiders Burning Man is still a big party where people get naked and do drugs. The message of community, gift economy, etc. will be diluted if insiders aren&#039;t the ones controlling the message.  

Webdaddy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not completely bad that someone &#8220;own&#8221; Burning Man. If the trademark is not protected, it becomes common usage. </p>
<p>Burning Man being public domain sounds great in theory, but if anyone can use the title Burning Man that also means nothing can stop Burning Man Girls Gone Wild hitting your local video store. Videos exploiting our community have already been stopped because of trademarks/copyrights in the past. Imagine nudity being taken out of context. Imagine you lose your job because your employer sees the video. Imagine what happens to the event if people feel less free to radically express themselves. </p>
<p>There is also more ability to control the message. To a lot of outsiders Burning Man is still a big party where people get naked and do drugs. The message of community, gift economy, etc. will be diluted if insiders aren&#8217;t the ones controlling the message.  </p>
<p>Webdaddy</p>
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		<title>By: John Hell</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-213</link>
		<dc:creator>John Hell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:54:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-213</guid>
		<description>John,

I believe myself to be an oddtimer. Not an oldtimer. First burn was in 94. I recall those days well. I recall the meeting at Somarts in 96. I recall Flash jumping you. I also recall a love for the freedom that the event represents. Having the name in the public domain is inevitable, in my opinion. In the end, what is there to protect?

You make the case, when you say that any true &quot;burners&quot; know what the event is really all about. They wouldn&#039;t accept any false substitutes. Let someone highjack the name and sell underware with it. I think it would be a great experiment in our culture to make the name public and then see where it goes. It&#039;s like raising a child and sending them off into the world. If you raised them right, they&#039;ll take risks, but the rewards will be great. What could Larry and Michael really be afraid of?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,</p>
<p>I believe myself to be an oddtimer. Not an oldtimer. First burn was in 94. I recall those days well. I recall the meeting at Somarts in 96. I recall Flash jumping you. I also recall a love for the freedom that the event represents. Having the name in the public domain is inevitable, in my opinion. In the end, what is there to protect?</p>
<p>You make the case, when you say that any true &#8220;burners&#8221; know what the event is really all about. They wouldn&#8217;t accept any false substitutes. Let someone highjack the name and sell underware with it. I think it would be a great experiment in our culture to make the name public and then see where it goes. It&#8217;s like raising a child and sending them off into the world. If you raised them right, they&#8217;ll take risks, but the rewards will be great. What could Larry and Michael really be afraid of?</p>
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		<title>By: Bro John</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-211</link>
		<dc:creator>Bro John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-211</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve seen a few mentions about eBay in your posts, including the anecdote about Tamara and her costumes.  I work for BMOrg as the intellectual property &quot;good cop&quot; and I&#039;m in a good position to tell you what really happened.  I wrote her and asked that she stop using &quot;Burning Man&quot; in the title of her auctions.  I said, &quot;This isn&#039;t a Burning Man skirt.  It&#039;s a skirt.  Burning Man didn&#039;t make it.  You did.  If you want to put &#039;perfect for Burning Man&#039; in the description, please do so.  But don&#039;t use it in the title.&quot;  Why?  Because eBay&#039;s search engine automatically displays those items with the search term in the title.  If you search on &quot;Burning Man&quot; and get tickets, or a book or photos or film which is about the event, great!  But why should you have to sort through a bunch of glow sticks, costumes, camping equipment, etc?  Sellers of those items are using the name to market, which we&#039;re really hoping to avoid.  But as an earlier post mentioned, it&#039;s also against eBay&#039;s rules and eBay enforces those rules.  Tamara wrote back and basically told us to stick it because she wanted to market her clothes with the Burning Man name.  She accused us of going corporate, even though she was the one who wanted to use someone else&#039;s name to increase her sales.  Nice gal, Tamara.  And by the way, John: didn&#039;t you ask BLCLLC to protect the trademark they&#039;re licensing?  I&#039;m kind of confused why the enforcement makes you unhappy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve seen a few mentions about eBay in your posts, including the anecdote about Tamara and her costumes.  I work for BMOrg as the intellectual property &#8220;good cop&#8221; and I&#8217;m in a good position to tell you what really happened.  I wrote her and asked that she stop using &#8220;Burning Man&#8221; in the title of her auctions.  I said, &#8220;This isn&#8217;t a Burning Man skirt.  It&#8217;s a skirt.  Burning Man didn&#8217;t make it.  You did.  If you want to put &#8216;perfect for Burning Man&#8217; in the description, please do so.  But don&#8217;t use it in the title.&#8221;  Why?  Because eBay&#8217;s search engine automatically displays those items with the search term in the title.  If you search on &#8220;Burning Man&#8221; and get tickets, or a book or photos or film which is about the event, great!  But why should you have to sort through a bunch of glow sticks, costumes, camping equipment, etc?  Sellers of those items are using the name to market, which we&#8217;re really hoping to avoid.  But as an earlier post mentioned, it&#8217;s also against eBay&#8217;s rules and eBay enforces those rules.  Tamara wrote back and basically told us to stick it because she wanted to market her clothes with the Burning Man name.  She accused us of going corporate, even though she was the one who wanted to use someone else&#8217;s name to increase her sales.  Nice gal, Tamara.  And by the way, John: didn&#8217;t you ask BLCLLC to protect the trademark they&#8217;re licensing?  I&#8217;m kind of confused why the enforcement makes you unhappy?</p>
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		<title>By: ddp</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-192</link>
		<dc:creator>ddp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:47:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-192</guid>
		<description>1996 was my first burn and 2006 was my eleventh.   I&#039;m pretty much in agreement with what DoggieHead wrote above.  I&#039;ve watched the event mutate over the years and I&#039;ve come to view Larry as a tragic impediment to its spirit and soul.  The allegations brought forth in both of these court filings seem to paint a clear target on the man in the hat.  It&#039;s obvious given the attendance and ticket prices that large quantities of money are at play and to simply take Larry at his word on the accounting has always struck me as unreasonably trusting.  Let the chips fall where they may!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1996 was my first burn and 2006 was my eleventh.   I&#8217;m pretty much in agreement with what DoggieHead wrote above.  I&#8217;ve watched the event mutate over the years and I&#8217;ve come to view Larry as a tragic impediment to its spirit and soul.  The allegations brought forth in both of these court filings seem to paint a clear target on the man in the hat.  It&#8217;s obvious given the attendance and ticket prices that large quantities of money are at play and to simply take Larry at his word on the accounting has always struck me as unreasonably trusting.  Let the chips fall where they may!</p>
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		<title>By: chrislove</title>
		<link>http://johnlaw.laughingsquid.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-171</link>
		<dc:creator>chrislove</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jan 2007 01:11:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnlawspeaks.wordpress.com/2007/01/10/a-fable/#comment-171</guid>
		<description>This is an appropriate battle at an appropriate time.  If Burning Man is all that it is supposed to be, then as an entity, it must be challenged.  Challenges bring about change, which brings about evolution.  Scatter the ownership to the wind!   Then see where the cards fall.  Otherwise, I agree with a prior post: 3 brains are better than one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is an appropriate battle at an appropriate time.  If Burning Man is all that it is supposed to be, then as an entity, it must be challenged.  Challenges bring about change, which brings about evolution.  Scatter the ownership to the wind!   Then see where the cards fall.  Otherwise, I agree with a prior post: 3 brains are better than one.</p>
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